View Full Version : Voter intimidation, fraud, misdirection, confusion, etc.

11-02-2008, 01:05 PM
So as we head into election day we have yet to see any of the fraudulent voters who were registered, actually show up and VOTE, like Mickey Mouse, etc.

On the other hand we are seeing the republicans scaring, threatening, intimidating and misdirecting/confusing demographically-democratic voters with all kinds of horrible crap.

The Associated Press: 'Tis the season for tricking voters (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gmNIDbwu0zmrI1pMMqyKZ6Lsg4uQD94700FG5)

In the hours before Election Day, as inevitable as winter, comes an onslaught of dirty tricks — confusing e-mails, disturbing phone calls and insinuating fliers left on doorsteps during the night.
The intent, almost always, is to keep folks from voting or to confuse them, usually through intimidation or misinformation. But in this presidential race, in which a black man leads most polls, some of the deceit has a decidedly racist bent.

Complaints have surfaced in predominantly African-American neighborhoods of Philadelphia where fliers have circulated, warning voters they could be arrested at the polls if they had unpaid parking tickets or if they had criminal convictions.
Over the weekend in Virginia, bogus fliers with an authentic-looking commonwealth seal said fears of high voter turnout had prompted election officials to hold two elections — one on Tuesday for Republicans and another on Wednesday for Democrats.
In New Mexico, two Hispanic women filed a lawsuit last week claiming they were harassed by a private investigator working for a Republican lawyer who came to their homes and threatened to call immigration authorities, even though they are U.S. citizens.
"He was questioning her status, saying that he needed to see her papers and documents to show that she was a U.S. citizen and was a legitimate voter," said Guadalupe Bojorquez, speaking on behalf of her mother, Dora Escobedo, a 67-year-old Albuquerque resident who speaks only Spanish. "He totally, totally scared the heck out of her."
In Pennsylvania, e-mails appeared linking Democrat Barack Obama to the Holocaust. "Jewish Americans cannot afford to make the wrong decision on Tuesday, Nov. 4," said the electronic message, paid for by an entity calling itself the Republican Federal Committee. "Many of our ancestors ignored the warning signs in the 1930s and 1940s and made a tragic mistake."
Laughlin McDonald, who leads the ACLU's Voting Rights Project, said he has never seen "an election where there was more interest and more voter turnout, and more efforts to suppress registration and turnout. And that has a real impact on minorities."
The Obama campaign and civil rights advocacy groups have signed up millions of new voters for this presidential race. In Ohio alone, some 600,000 have submitted new voter registration cards.
Across the country, many of these first-time voters are young and strong Obama supporters. Many are also black and Hispanic.
Activist groups say it is this fresh crop of ballot-minded citizens that makes some Republicans very nervous. And they say they expect the dirty tricks to get dirtier in final hours before Tuesday.
"Oh, there's plenty of time for things to get ugly," said Zachary Stalberg, president of The Committee of Seventy, a Philadelphia-based government watchdog group that is nonpartisan.
Other reports of intimidation efforts in the hotly contested state of Pennsylvania include leaflets taped to picnic benches at Drexel University, warning students that police would be at the polls on Tuesday to arrest would-be voters with prior criminal offenses.
In his Jewish neighborhood, Stalberg said, fliers were recently left claiming Obama was more sympathetic to Palestinians than to Israel, and showed a photograph of him speaking in Germany.
"It shows up between the screen door and the front door in the middle of the night," Stalberg said. "Why couldn't someone knock on the door and hand that to me in the middle of the day? In a sense, it's very smartly done. The message gets through. It's done carefully enough that people might read it."
Such tactics are common, and are often impossible to trace. Robo-calls, in which automated, bogus phone messages are sent over and over, are very hard to trace to their source, say voting advocates. E-mails fall into the same category.
In Nevada, for example, Latino voters said they had received calls from people describing themselves as Obama volunteers, urging them to cast their ballot over the phone.
The calls were reported to Election Protection, a nonprofit advocacy group that runs a hot line for election troubles. The organization does not know who orchestrated them.
"The Voting Rights Act makes it a crime to misled and intimidate voters," said McDonald. "If you can find out who's doing it, those people should be prosecuted. But sometimes it's just difficult to know who's doing what. Some of it's just anonymous."
Trying to mislead voters is nothing new.
"We see this every year," said Jonah Goldman of the advocacy group Lawyers' Committee for Civil Rights Under Law. "It all happens around this time when there's too much other stuff going on in the campaigns, and it doesn't get investigated."
In 2006, automated phone calls in the final days leading to the federal election wrongly warned voters they would not be allowed to vote without a photo ID. In Colorado and Virginia, people reported receiving calls that told them their registrations had expired and they would be arrested if they showed up to vote.
The White House contest of 2004 was marked by similar deceptions. In Milwaukee, fliers went up advising people "if you've already voted in any election this year, you can't vote in the presidential election." In Pennsylvania, a letter bearing what appeared to be the McCandless Township seal falsely proclaimed that in order to cut long voting lines, Republicans would cast ballots on Nov. 2 and Democrats would vote on Nov. 3.
E-mail assaults have become increasingly popular this year, keeping pace with the proliferation of blogging and Obama's massive online campaign efforts, according to voting activists.
"It is newer and more furious than it ever has been before," Goldman said.
And Republicans are not exempt. "Part of it is that election campaigns are more online than ever before," said Goldman. "During the primaries, a lot of Web sites went up that seemed to be for (GOP candidate Rudy) Giuliani, but actually were attack sites."
New York City's former mayor and his high-profile colleagues Fred Thompson and Mitt Romney were also targeted in fake Internet sites that featured "quotes" from the candidates espousing support for extreme positions they never endorsed.

11-02-2008, 07:34 PM
Then again, is pandering to stupid people so that you can get their votes without ever actually telling them what you stand for a 'fair' strategy?

11-02-2008, 08:26 PM
Is that subjective analysis of Obama's platform your only response to illegal disenfranchisement of his supporters?

11-02-2008, 09:32 PM
I think the first one is a great idea... If you haven't paid your fines you don't vote. If you are a criminal and have a warrant for your arrest you will be arrested when you show your ID to vote.

11-02-2008, 11:15 PM
What about just the criminal part abb? I have no warrants. Lets also keep in mind, the father who worked for McDonald's, and was charged 1.2mil per child(2 children all together) for child support every year, would also be considered a criminal since he was unable to pay the fees. Obviously, considering he was working at McD's.

11-03-2008, 12:24 AM
It's not a good idea because police shouldn't hang around polling places, it intimidates people!

11-03-2008, 04:30 AM
It's very sad the Republicans have to stoop to this level, I knew they would though. They seem to have lost their morals a few elections ago. And Degausser, EVERYBODY has a right to vote no matter how stupid or racist they are. I may dislike all the people voting against Obama just because hes black and stuff like that but I will be damned if I won't defend their right to vote undeterred and unharassed. What the republicans are doing is IMMMORAL and unpatriotic to the extreme.

11-03-2008, 05:18 AM
You act as if it's republican policy to do this. It's a couple *******s, not the whole party.

I'm not saying dumbasses shouldn't vote, I'm saying that obama is leading them to blindly vote for him. If the lower class really knew what democrats stand for, they would ALWAYS vote republican.

11-03-2008, 06:07 AM
most of the republican party nowadays needs to get kicked out of the republican party.

go back a couple decades and you can really see how ****ed up most of the party is now.

11-03-2008, 12:04 PM
I don't see what the big deal is, according to all of the polling data I've seen, McCain is going to need a miracle to win anyway. And if you don't trust the media, then you can take a look at McCain's itinerary to get a feel for how well he's doing - the only traditionally blue state he's stopping in on his final day of campaigning in Pennsylvania, the rest are all traditionally GOP sure-wins, and he's ending his day in his home state of Arizona where the polls show Obama as an average of only three and a half points behind. He's on the defensive, and Obama isn't showing any signs of letting up, making stops in all red states on his last day.

McCain is going to be toast, pretty much anyway you slice it.

11-03-2008, 12:22 PM
You act as if it's republican policy to do this. It's a couple *******s, not the whole party.

I'm not saying dumbasses shouldn't vote, I'm saying that obama is leading them to blindly vote for him. If the lower class really knew what democrats stand for, they would ALWAYS vote republican.
It's interesting that you say this considering that if people truly voted with their pocketbooks, then most people would vote democrat since the democrats favor taxing the rich and tax cuts for the poor. But right now all those idiotic white trash evangelicals vote republican for religious reasons even though those same republicans are screwing them over economically with tax-payer welfare for rich corporations that don't need it.

The oil companies just posted their biggest quarter profits in history even accounting for inflation. Is there some reason they needed the subsidies and tax breaks that they got?

11-03-2008, 01:21 PM
I wasn't speaking strictly 'voting out of their pocketbooks', however Republicans are typically for a lower tax standard, along with rewarding companies sometimes, whereas Democrats want to raise taxes for everyone, but unequally so that the people who have money become responsible for those who don't.

The Dems preach all of these 'nice' things they'll do for the lower class, but really where does it get them? Does being given welfare provide someone incentive to better themselves? Does the endless cycle of buerocracy inspire them to try to break the glass ceiling? No, it provides them a blissful ignorance to be the working class slaves of the Democrat party.

If you really think about it, the Dems really are the party of bigotry; they usually harbor all of the snooty atheists who find religion a waste of space, they are all about white guilt and how we can make those of other races stick out like a sore thumb and feel indignant, while supporting the negative influences that build a cycle of racism against whites, thus furthering class warfare and the racial divide; and most pertinent to this fact, they support the joke of 'public education' that is so moronic that even with a high school degree, one can barely become more than a middle class businessman without going to colleges where they spend far too much money and get thrown an insane liberal bias and told it's an education!

So i ask you Mobilus, are the Democrats REALLY the people you want in a place of power, or would you, like me, rather see some goddamn change in America.

11-03-2008, 01:43 PM
I've been a member of the democratic party since I turned 18, in 1998. I don't know how old you are Degausser, but I've seen my fair share of presidents. Out of the last eight presidential terms (80-84, 84-88, 88-92, 92-96, 96-00, 00-04, 04-08), only two have been occupied by a democrat - the Clinton administration in back-to-back terms between 1992 and 2000. It may come as a shock to you, but the prosperity seen during the Clinton administration over all is the most prosperous this country has been over the past fifty years. Record surplus', historically low deficits, historically high employment rates, etc. So, you really have to ask yourself - do you really believe this crap you talk about, Republicans meaning change in the right direction, or do you realize that they've had their shot and blew it every single time with the exception of Reagan, and he only did an 'ok' job.

The fact of the matter is, the GOP had their chance six out of eight times over the past thirty years and they screwed the pooch. It's time to let people who know what they are doing have a crack at it.

11-03-2008, 01:48 PM
I don't really like the democrats that much but they are opposed to Bush's policies so I want them in power for about 4-8 years to revert all the damage and then I'd like both parties to take a hike.

11-03-2008, 01:52 PM
The fact of the matter is, the GOP had their chance six out of eight times over the past thirty years and they screwed the pooch. It's time to let people who know what they are doing have a crack at it.

I do have to give Reagan credit though. He did realize that the tax system was unAmercian. The Grace Commission gives us a fairly accurate picture of how we have been duped for decades now. He attempted to reign in the monster that is the Fed, but with no success. Not a single recommendation from that Commission was put into policy. It could have saved us trillions. It's just sad.

11-03-2008, 02:02 PM
My point was that, Republicans have been in power for a long time. A long ass mother****ing time. And yet they blame all of our misfortune on their opponents. Sounds like bull**** to me, they're just making excuses. Time to take some responsibility for failure of epic proportions.

11-03-2008, 02:41 PM
Don't assume that all 'power' comes from the presidency, you have to think at a legislative level as well, not to mention individual states. Michigan for one has been suffering under Granholm for a while now.

11-03-2008, 02:54 PM
Actually, Degsauce, you bring up a good point.

But even Clinton fought AGAINST the republican controlled house after the 94 republican revolution. And up until recently, its been in that control since. Also 82-88.

11-03-2008, 03:05 PM
While the president does not have absolute power, he comes pretty close. First of all, he can freely appoint Supreme Court Justices (the primary power holders of the Judicial branch) and every other staff member of the executive branch (his cabinet members) and is the top of the food chain when it comes to military command. Secondly, he can veto anything he please from the legislative side. And considering it takes an overwhelming support to get legislation past a veto (much more than a simple majority), you're looking at a monolith of power, which is even more extensive in years where there are open Supreme Court seats and a roughly evenly divided Congress.

The fact of the matter is, if the Republicans had any super miracle solutions to our problems, they've had ample opportunity to enact them and they haven't. Actions speak louder than words. Time to give someone else a shot.

11-03-2008, 08:33 PM
My prediction is this: the incoming president will continue the policies we have already seen, and continue to advance the agenda. Even if Obama should win, once in office he will NOT withdraw from Iraq. He has already said that any talk of renegotiating NAFTA is just talk. I'm sure he'll happily invoke the fear of terrorism to keep the people unified.

No power changes hands.